Author Topic: Wysong?  (Read 3759 times)

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Offline Pookie

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Wysong?
« on: February 15, 2013, 12:05:17 PM »
I get Dr. Becker's newsletter, and one of the articles had a comment singing the praises of Wysong's new dry food, Epigen, which is apparently grain AND starch-free.  And yet when I went to the website (http://www.wysongepigen.net/), I couldn't find an ingredient list to tell me what's in it, or just HOW this dry food is made (supposedly the patent is pending), since it's my understanding that all kibble needs some kind of starch to be formed into pellets.  Supposedly the starch has been replaced with meat so it's closer to what nature intended, and it can be fed to dogs and cats.  I guess he never got the memo that cats need MOISTURE.   :-\

Any thoughts on this?  I've never tried Wysong and don't know how good the brand is.  I'm not thinking of buying it, but just would like to hear everyone's opinion on it.
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Offline DeeDee

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2013, 06:06:36 PM »
I couldn't find an ingredient list to tell me what's in it, or just HOW this dry food is made (supposedly the patent is pending), since it's my understanding that all kibble needs some kind of starch to be formed into pellets.

The ingredients list: http://www.wysongepigen.net/ingredients.php It explains the use of each ingredient in there. But no...I wouldn't feed it to a cat b/c it's still going to require too much water (that they most likely won't drink) to properly digest it.

I MIGHT soak it in water or some kind of broth until it had completely expanded & was moist & feed it to them--IF they'd eat it. But one of those formulas says "fish" and you're not supposed to feed them that, are you?

I'd NEVER feed it to the boys because of this information alone:

Quote
- Vegetable Protein (consisting of one or more of the following: Potato Protein, Rice Protein, Corn Protein, Wheat Protein): By special processing, the starches are removed. The remaining proteins and other important nutrient elements are then incorporated into Epigen™. The long protein chains help shape and bind the kibbles so that starches do not have to be used.

Corn, Rice, Wheat in ANY form are NOT going in my dogs. I've lived with a dog with food allergies--I'll never allow it to happen again. Those 3 ingredients are BIG "NO" items for me. I don't care what they say they've done to it.
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Offline Middle Child

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2013, 09:36:57 PM »
Just another marketing scam IMO.  How do you remove the starch from corn and potatoes and rice?  And remember, once the water is removed that organic chicken drops down the list to behind those vegetable proteins.  And even so, that doesn't change the fact that these are PLANT proteins, something a cat's body does not have the enzymes to digest.  And apples? beet pulp? Wheat grass? And other fruits and vegetables besides.

And it's still dry.

What a hoax.

Offline Amber

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2013, 01:09:59 AM »
Just going to point out that the Wysong company does not actually promote feeding kibble. Quite the opposite, actually. If one read their site, they advocate fresh whole foods as much as possible. If one pulls up the pamphlet on the eipigen 90, he/she sees this:

Quote
The Evolution of Kibble Stops Here™
The movement toward/return to biologically appropriate foods for pets has been slow. This is due in large part
to what occurred decades ago, which was a decided movement in the opposite direction.
The course of pet foods was most distinctly set in motion in the 1950's with the introduction of dry, extruded
pet food, a.k.a. "kibble" (see our Pet Food Timeline:  www.wysongepigen.net/timeline.php).
Many forms of pet food have come and gone over the years, and there are a number of alternative offerings
currently in the marketplace, but to this day, due to convenience and marketing, kibble remains the
undisputed king.
In truth, kibble marks the greatest misstep in the history of animal nutrition.
You see, from the beginning kibble was not something that was engineered to be nutritious and biologically
appropriate for the animal, something that bore a close resemblance to their natural diet. It was not --as
should have been the case --form following from function (nutrition). Rather, the goal was to create
something that was efficient and profit-bearing for the manufacturer, and convenient for the pet caretaker.
Kibble fit (and still fits) that bill to a T.
Without examining each step along the way, kibble has gone from being something that didn't even
approximate being biologically appropriate, to, in recent times, something that does a slightlybetter job of it.
Consider the following:
  The natural canine/feline diet is raw. Kibble is highly processed (cooked).
  The natural canine/feline diet contains no starch. Since its inception, and prior to the release of
Epigen™, kibble has been mainly starch ingredients (poly-sugars).
  The natural canine/feline diet consists of meats, organs, bone, tendons, etc. --nearly all
elements of the prey creature. Kibbles contain these ingredients at low levels.
  The canine/feline dental structure and jaw mechanisms are designed for tearing and ripping
prey. Kibble requires crunching and chewing.
  The natural canine/feline diet is varied. Kibble diets are most often fed exclusively.
© 2010, Wysong Corporation
So what must be understood is that kibble was a flawed enterprise from the start. It still is. It will forever be.
This is what so many of the more dedicated, caring and studied members of the pet caretaker community
simply fail to understand. They want the perfect kibble (an impossibility). They want a kibble that contains, or
lacks this or that ingredient. They want X% protein, and Y% fat. Minutia is the focus. They incorrectly view
"nutritional" adjustments to an inherently, substantially flawed food as the key to their beloved pet’s health.
The big picture is missed.
And this is no coincidence --minutia is just what pet food companies have directed pet caretakers' focus to
since the beginning. There are dollars to be made by directing consumer attention away from the obvious
problems with feeding a starch-based kibble meal after meal.
From our perspective, the question is not how we can convince you that we've created the perfect kibble, but
rather how we can best deal with the kibble problem.
Now that kibble is the universally accepted pet food
form, what can we do about it? How can we improve and advance it in substantial and meaningful ways? How
can we make that which is inherently unnatural morenatural?
Epigen 90™ is an honest attempt at just that --righting, as much as possible, the wrong. Fitting the square peg
(kibble) in the round hole (biologically appropriate nutrition). With Epigen 90™ we've accomplished this to the
greatest extent possible.
Is it perfect? No. Are there inherent flaws with kibble that simply cannot be overcome? Yes.
One thing is for sure though -- The Evolution of Kibble StopsHere™

Wysong has released numerous kibble alternatives -- our TNT™ line of raw products and canned diets, for example. One solution to the problem is, of course, to move away from kibble. But millions of pet caretakers won't consider it because of habit and convenience. Multi-billion dollar companies have a stake in this not happening. Kibble is here to stay for the foreseeable future. Wysong considers it a responsibility to improve kibble to the greatest extent possible. That's what Epigen is all about[/i
]

Offline Lola

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2013, 02:17:35 AM »
Pookie,
Do you have a dog?
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Offline Middle Child

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2013, 09:51:58 AM »
Just going to point out that the Wysong company does not actually promote feeding kibble. Quite the opposite, actually. If one read their site, they advocate fresh whole foods as much as possible. If one pulls up the pamphlet on the eipigen 90, he/she sees this:
]

Sure. They like to make themselves sound good, so people will think wow this company is so ethical, let's buy their kibble. And yet, they have at least SEVEN different lines of dry cat food, some balanced, some meant as supplemental feeding only, including a VEGAN formula.  Doh1 bangshead

Offline Pookie

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2013, 11:40:20 AM »
Pookie,
Do you have a dog?

Nope, though I grew up with them and considered myself a dog person until I got cats.  :)  The only reason I looked at this product was because I was curious about the ingredients, and just HOW they manage to make a dry food without the starch.  Personally, I don't care how much meat protein or how little starch they claim it has, the bottom line to me is that it's dry food and therefore not species-appropriate, IMO.

Thanks for finding the ingredient list, DeeDee!  I noticed for the chicken formula they also list "Dried Wheat Grass Powder, Dried Barley Grass Powder."  Seriously?   bangshead
« Last Edit: February 16, 2013, 11:45:12 AM by Pookie »
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Offline CarnivorousCritter

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2013, 11:14:38 PM »
Sure. They like to make themselves sound good, so people will think wow this company is so ethical, let's buy their kibble. And yet, they have at least SEVEN different lines of dry cat food, some balanced, some meant as supplemental feeding only, including a VEGAN formula.  Doh1 bangshead

Bingo.  IMO these "businesses" are *probably more dangerous than the usual PFI culprits because exposing the flaws of the "usuals" is so cut & dry.

A while back, looking for websites to cite, I'd find ones preaching allll about cats being OCs within their first paragraphs and get all psyched -- but would read on and find it was just hook, line & sinkers.   Doh1  

Offline CarnivorousCritter

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2013, 11:21:58 PM »
I know it gets reeeeealy old, especially on one forum and perhaps here too (with the same rants-vents), but that's why I harp on the teeth....and vets not knowing better to tell clients differently than what they are...  :-[

There's no way they can even chew it.  It's like us trying to swallow-shatter a corn chip & swallowing it.  

Offline CarnivorousCritter

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2013, 11:28:46 PM »
LOL @ this, the hypocrites.

Quote
One solution to the problem is, of course, to move away from kibble. But millions of pet caretakers won't consider it because of habit and convenience. Multi-billion dollar companies have a stake in this not happening. Kibble is here to stay for the foreseeable future. Wysong considers it a responsibility to improve kibble to the greatest extent possible.

How hypocrital is that?!!  bangshead

Let's ask these hypocrites if theirs is any easier to chew.

Offline Amber

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2013, 03:47:13 AM »
I don't really see it as hypocritical. They actually try to dissuade people from feeding kibble, and from feed exclusively or mainly processed foods, and their vegan foods actually come with an insert telling people that this is a bad idea, we understand your morals but please don't do this to your cat. However, as unfortunate as it is, there ARE people who will not consider feeding any thing but processed foods or anything but KIBBLE, and there are some cats, like Bump, who flat won't eat anything but kibble. They acknowledge that kibble is not good to feed, but people are going to feed it anyway, so they are trying to make it better. Not the best food out there, but better than what is currently out there. Just like there are some EXTREMELY misguided people who refuse to feed animal based foods to their pets, because of their own beliefs about what is ethical.

Offline CarnivorousCritter

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2013, 10:20:47 AM »
I see your point, but they say ...

Quote
and their vegan foods actually come with an insert telling people that this is a bad idea, we understand your morals but please don't do this to your cat.

They don't just say it, but actually provide the product itself -- themselves :-X

Beyond despicable, IMO.   

This is why it's sooo hard to convince people about the obligate carnivore thing.   Such people as these,  who do seem to have a clue, always compromise  -- and BIG time -- for the sake of the almighty $$  :(  There will always be that gray area.   Not so good for the ever-rising Diabetic & PU surgery victims out there.    :(




Offline Middle Child

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2013, 12:47:32 PM »
I see your point, but they say ...

They don't just say it, but actually provide the product itself -- themselves :-X

Beyond despicable, IMO.   

This is why it's sooo hard to convince people about the obligate carnivore thing.   Such people as these,  who do seem to have a clue, always compromise  -- and BIG time -- for the sake of the almighty $$  :(  There will always be that gray area.   Not so good for the ever-rising Diabetic & PU surgery victims out there.    :(





Agree with you completely.  There seems to be an epidemic of that PU surgery.  Vets getting rich off of unethical pet food manufactures, not to mention all the suffering these cats go through. All which could be avoided, if the cats were fed a wet, high animal protein diet.

Offline Lola

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Re: Wysong?
« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2013, 02:00:37 PM »
I would give them a "pass" if they (for example) had fishy wet food and suggested it not be fed every day. it is still edible food, but not good for every day feeding.  (I'm also pretending their fish is from a good source.) 

I also think, when the average person sees, that a "reputable" company makes this and that, they ASSuME more than they probably should.  Manufactures know that. 

In a nutshell, I think Wysong is playing both sides of the fence. 

Just my  2cents

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