Author Topic: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!  (Read 14535 times)

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Offline Lola

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #45 on: November 18, 2011, 12:24:44 PM »
I forgot that I did once put out a few pieces of raw chicken breast as a test.  Some ate it with gusto...others walked away.  I'll try that again.  This time I will mix it IN with their meal. 

Step one...
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Offline Amber

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #46 on: November 19, 2011, 02:26:17 AM »
If he/she balks at fully raw food but likes it cooked, you could try searing the meat, or starting off with it fully cooked and then cook it less and less over time to get him/her used to it.

Offline Lola

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #47 on: November 20, 2011, 02:34:59 PM »
The Hubster cut up one raw chicken breast into fairly small pieces.  Wanted small pieces for the first go, due to the texture change.  Mixed the raw in with their regular wet food.
4 ate with gusto.   3...not so thrilled, but ate.  Next meal, did the same thing.  All 7 ate every bite.   :D
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Offline Shadow

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #48 on: November 20, 2011, 05:24:00 PM »
So since my brother has had dealings with premade ground Raw and Campylobacter, they are unsure about this whole raw feeding. Now I am concerened too after reading this. Raw feeders please add your two cents.

Taken from this site
http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/Cautions_Raw_Food.htm                                                             
Quote
Another type of bacteria which could potentially be fatal to a dog when the immune system is compromised is Campylobacter.  Campylobacter is a common bacteria that is often the cause of food poisoning in people.  Campylobacter can be found in most raw meats, especially poultry, and can also be found in raw milk and even contaminated water. Most healthy people (and dogs) can recover from campylobacter without much incident, however compromised people (and dogs) may not recover well and have episodes of vomiting, listlessness, diarrhea, and can even cause a wide range of ailments not usually considered; including urinary track infections and meningitis, or even death.

Following is an excerpt from the FDA's website on a study conducted by the Minnesota Dept. of Health on the frequency campylobacter is found in chicken:
http://vm.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/fdcampy.html

"Although found in many farm animals, Campylobacter in poultry is causing experts the most concern. There have been several studies pointing to high levels of Campylobacter present on poultry at the retail level, including a recent two-year Minnesota Department of Health study that found that 88percent of poultry sampled from local supermarkets tested positive for the bacteria.

"The retail study was in collaboration with the Minnesota Department of Agriculture; their inspectors went to supermarkets throughout the St. Paul/Minneapolis Twin Cities area to cover a variety of supermarket types, from big chains to mom-and-pop stores," says Kirk E. Smith, D.V.M., a Minnesota state epidemiologist who participated in the study.

Many prior surveys have found Campylobacter contamination rates of between 40 and 60 percent, he says. "But 88 percent--this degree of contamination surprised even me," he admits."

The FDA's article also goes on to say:

"Symptoms of campylobacteriosis usually occur within two to 10 days of ingesting the bacteria. Children, the elderly, and people with weakened immune systems are particularly at risk."

Now we know that all raw meats that we buy wether it be organic, or not, it has been through a slaughter house, etc. so there is more risk.
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Offline Auntie Crazy

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #49 on: November 20, 2011, 09:44:58 PM »
Balancing our cat's diet is really no different than balancing our own, and truly shouldn't be a cause for stress. If it is, however, no amount of reading is going to assuage or diminish the fear - the only way to handle it is to plunge right into it. You'll be amazed at how short a time it takes before preparing their meals becomes as natural as finding your way home from work every night. Honest. <<<hugs>>>

As for bacterial fears, this article should alleviate them for you: Salmonella, E. coli, and Listeria, oh my!

And don't forget - home-prepared diets are not the only raw diets available. There are quite a few healthy, reasonably-priced commercial raw diets available, including at least one (Nature's Variety Instinct) that addresses consumer fear by guaranteeing its products are pathogen-free.

Best regards.

AC
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Offline Shadow

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #50 on: November 20, 2011, 09:54:47 PM »
My brothers cat got Campylobacter while on a raw commercial diet. :-\
I actually gave him that same link that you just provided, but it doesnt say anything about Campylobacter??
Hmm...
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Offline Auntie Crazy

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #51 on: November 20, 2011, 11:22:26 PM »
My brothers cat got Campylobacter while on a raw commercial diet. :-\
I actually gave him that same link that you just provided, but it doesnt say anything about Campylobacter??
Hmm...

All bacteria are handled by a cat's body in precisely the same way.

I'm very interested in these types of incidents. What was the cat eating when he was diagnosed, how long had he been eating it, and what was he eating before the transition to raw? How old was the cat, and was he an indoor/outdoor kitty?

AC
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Offline Amber

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #52 on: November 20, 2011, 11:55:27 PM »
Because of worry about bacteria, I parboil or parbroil Amber's meat before putting it in the food processor. I would probably not worry about it if I knew for a fact that her immune system was functioning normally, but there is evidence to suggest otherwise. I had a blood panel done when she was fighting a really bad staph infection, and the blood panel showed that her white blood cell count, which should have been elevated during an infection, was very low. For a while I cooked her meat throughout before adding the premix, which I was assured by the company would have been fine long term, but eventually I got comfortable with leaving it 25-50% cooked and 50-75% raw. Dr. Pierson herself does this with all of her cats' food, and lists it as a requirement for the safety of immunocomprimised cats.  cat3

Offline Shadow

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #53 on: November 21, 2011, 02:34:54 AM »
All bacteria are handled by a cat's body in precisely the same way.

I'm very interested in these types of incidents. What was the cat eating when he was diagnosed, how long had he been eating it, and what was he eating before the transition to raw? How old was the cat, and was he an indoor/outdoor kitty?

AC
Hi AC I had to go over to itchmo to see when I posted about his cats Campy, lol! Im sure he wont remember the exact date it happened, it was August of 2008, and his cat is 3.5 yrs old. The Raw food is a local company that specializes in just making pet food. It was a premade ground food. It is an indoor only male ragdoll. I will answer the other questions once he tells me tommorow. Im up too late as it is, I have emailed him about it.  I guess he is too busy to join the forum. :-\
edit, if the cat got Campy when it was 6 months old, can the reason for Campylobacter be from the breeder he got it from?? hmmm :-\
« Last Edit: November 21, 2011, 02:39:56 AM by Shadow »
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Offline Pookie

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #54 on: November 23, 2011, 09:04:54 AM »
Just a suggestion:  maybe he should mix in some probiotics in the catfood for several days/weeks before making the switch to raw?  That way he can be building up the immune system and any harmful bacteria would have less of a chance of taking over.

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Offline FurMonster Mom

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Re: Let's kick-start the raw feeding section!
« Reply #55 on: November 26, 2011, 02:18:56 PM »
From the CDC and USDA articles I've read, Campy is extremely common. 
It's so common, that I wouldn't be surprised if our bodies deal with it on almost a daily basis.  People get ill from it when they encounter an excessive amount all at once, and the body just can't deal with it all.  Healthy people generally recover within a week.

Also, there is a key phrase in the first sentence of that article;
Quote
Another type of bacteria which could potentially be fatal to a dog when the immune system is compromised is Campylobacter.

When you see that phrase, you should automatically think "the very young, and the very old" (or those on imuno-suppressant drugs).
The fact that your brother's cat was quite young when it came down with the associated illness could be a factor.

It was also mentioned in one of the articles I read that freezing can reduce the bacterial load.
I always rinse my meats well before processing and freezing, and have not had any issues so far.

 grouphug
meow meow meow meow meow meow? -woof!
Translation: "I can has my raw food? -please!"

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